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Friday, February 13, 2015

Some More Photos of the New DFA Lenses





I have lost clue to the sources of the photos as these are found in the Internet Pentax forums, so cannot make the credits.

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illdefined's avatar

illdefined · 527 weeks ago

Great. So after ALL this time, Pentax FF lenses will be the exact same size as their long established competition.

They are literally bringing nothing new to the table...long after the party already ended. This is the opposite of innovation.
20 replies · active 526 weeks ago
But this is actually what the market wants! For instance, the new Sony FE 70-200 F4 is not smaller and lighter than the Canon counterpart.
illdefined's avatar

illdefined · 526 weeks ago

But the A7 mirrorless bodies they attach to are a fraction of the size of DSLRs and are also weather resistant. The A7II even has IBIS. What is Pentax bringing that's new?
So, were you thinking that Ricoh/Pentax engineers had some magic recipee to break physics laws and design smaller lenses than everyone else, that could cover the same image circle as any other 35mm camera? I mean... you can't be THAT unrealistic in your expectations... People wanted modern high quality FF lenses... There they are! Just as compact as could be possibly made. Optics design require compromises... you just can't have it all...
illdefined's avatar

illdefined · 526 weeks ago

Pentax was absolutely known for making small high-quality FF lenses. Prime example are the FA Limiteds. Their non-Limited FA primes and zooms were also smaller than the competition.
I think Ricoh-Pentax will sell a lot of these high desired lenses! In my opinion they are not too large. You have an alternatieve : APS-C with 60-250 / 50-135 ......
I have doubt if those high-end new Pentax lenses will sell a lot, as most existing Pentax fanboys seldom buy and most real old Pentax buyers who were willing to buy are rare nowadays! The worst thing is that most of those real buyers had switched and gone long ago and it must be rather difficult for them to switch again and come back.
I think you're quite right. Considering the utter dearth of responses to this blog following Pentax's announcement, a blog that has been waiting for Pentax full frame for many years, I think Pentax are too late and the market has substantially changed.

The problem for many Pentax users is whether to hold out for Pentax to produce a full frame camera they want and hope that enough other people want it too, to make it a long term viable proposition. There exists the risk this could be a financial calamity for Pentax and we see just one full frame camera, likely just a K-3 with SAFOX XI and an old generation Sony sensor.

To buy into a system we have to be confident the system will still be there in 5-10 years. I'm not convinced it will be as big heavy DSLR's and big heavy lenses will steadily be replaced by much lighter and smaller mirrorless cameras and light weight lenses. This is already happening. I own one and although it's very far from great, the concept is there and by the 3rd generation I suspect this will perform like a DSLR, possibly faster.

And of course the joy of mirrorless is registration distance and adaptation. You can be confident your old lenses (with some exceptions) will work on mirrorless regardless and I suspect the market in AF adapters will grow over time and cover many more mounts.

What Pentax has revealed so far is a lump of 3D printed plastic from under a bit of old bed sheet in the corner of some exhibition hall whilst at the same time asking Pentax users what they want in it.

Not a good start.

In the cold light of day, not sure I want to take the risk, although I'd really like to see Pentax thrive.
pentax fan's avatar

pentax fan · 527 weeks ago

I'll take the risk. They are going the right direction. I just wish they released the camera at the same time as the lenses.

There's also the chance the 70-200f2.8 is even better than the legandary 200mm macro! It looks that good.
agree with this's avatar

agree with this · 527 weeks ago

They won't sell many UNTIL they have the camera released. Why invest so much money on the chance they might not deliver the FF camera? They should have released the camera FIRST because people already have the good FA 2.8 and prime lenses (with aperture rings too).
Yes, I can't figure that out either. These are big, heavy and expensive lenses. They may be the best lenses ever, who knows, but no way would I buy either without knowing a. a Pentax FF was going to actually be made (still unsure), b. the FF was going to perform (i.e., not just relying on SAFOX XI) and c. that I was more confident in the future of the brand.

Even then, the last thing I want these days is big heavy glass to lug through airports and around countries. I need light, not necessarily small, but not too heavy.

Just updated the A7r to v1.10 firmware and fitted the Tough E-mount. Definitely improved in some areas. Also looking at Sony's lens roadmap for full frame E-mount, it makes sense. They too have a 24-70 f/2.8 coming soon and what with that and the 35/1.4, 28/2 with conversion glass, 16-35/4, 90 macro and the possibility the legendary 135 f/1.8 might be made for E-mount (I hope) . . . throw in the future, development and ongoing popularity of the A7 series and . . . .

. . . well you can guess.

Brand loyalty is one thing but the brand doesn't deliver, how far do you go with it?

On balance, looking at recent Pentax and Sony announcements, right now I think my photographic future is with Sony. I'm sad to say that, but it is what it is.
I'm willing to give them a chance. Waited long enough. I am beyond happy they FINALLY decided to do full frame. I think delaying because of the 645 did major loss of customers. The big lenses aren't great for travel, but serve their purpose.

They do need to do something about the primes and small zooms. The FA77 is hyped so bad, but it is a purple fringing monster. The FA85 is AWESOME, but not available anymore. The FA31 suffers from serious manufacturing tolerance quality issues. Search "wobble hood" and "FA31". For $1200 new or whatever, there should be NO sample variance.

They really need lenses at the short end, especially for Full Frame.

The old 28mm lenses, I never liked... The compact brilliant FA20-35 is discontinued. The 20mm and under full frame primes are crazy expensive and questionable for sharpness.

The FA43 is near perfection, however, and remarkably affordable. That's the essence of Pentax to me. Nice small prime. The FA35 is a near perfect lens. The DA35 should be scrap and bring back the FA35 too.
I'm at this crossroads too. But right now Sony is winning.

I have FA's 31/43/50/77 and K-50/1.2, 100/2.8 Macro, 15/4 Ltd . . . K-5IIs and K-3.

Had the AIV 31 Ltd wobble problem and got it fixed, it's great now. When I got it, it was ghastly, I mean heartbreakingly awful . Asahi Photo in London stripped it down and re-built it. £85. Golden!

My MIJ 43 is soft as hell wide open (as it's designed to be I believe) but sharpens right up stopped down. There's something about that lens that's just magic, especially on full frame (a7r).

My AIV 77 is razer sharp from wide open and I've never had a PF issue with it. Possibly my favorite ever lens for all manner of reasons.

K-50/1.2 is great but my Reuenon 55/1.2 is way, way better in all possibly ways.

But what to do? Sell the lot and go all in Sony FE? I have the 55/1.8 and it's ultra sharp/smooth bokeh (has green fringing though only at extreme contrast). I like the look of the forthcoming Sony Zeiss FE glass.

What I'd prefer is a really good autofocus adapter for PK>E-mount to handle my 31/43/77/100macro and carry on with the A7 series, possibly hanging it out for the 3rd generation.

One lens that really is great for both is the Samyang 14mm f/2.8 (if you get a properly corrected copy). That's a bargain lens!
I'am not sure of course, I hope they will sell! The current new D-FA's, the coming FF and coming D-FA (wide zoom) should give them a good / better market position..... May be good /agressive marketing is lacking (Canon/Nikon do a much better job). I will be honest, if Sigma 150-600 Sports was available in K- mount I should buy it (good image quality / parts made of metal / cheaper). However there is not a K-mount and the new D-DFA's are really beasts....I am a big Pentax fan, and I hope everything will be better now, but I'am not sure..... And indeed may bewe will see just one FF camera .... May be new Canon with 400L 5.6 prime is a better/cheaper solution. I still hope the accouncement of a big boy long telelens, Pentax D-FA ** 500/600 4.0. But I think they will NEVER accounce it, not enough buyers... I don't like DA 560, very strange lens, not good enough image-quality related to other lenses. Moving to Canon/Nikon, I'am not sure and I doubt and doubt and doubt ... I "love" the brand Pentax, and not Canon/Nikon..... Sony for me is a no-brand..... Let' wait the future, how will existing Pentax shooters react and how not-currently Pentax-users. I am not a marketeer, but I am positive because Pentax brand is mythical, robust and honest ...... I bought black K-S1, I like it really, may me I am not objective enough, but why should I? It's all about emotion......
I disagree. If they make one, they'll be at least two FF cameras. There's enough demand to sell thousands at the right price. It's the second one that might be soft in demand.

If they only make one, don't expect the price to drop. It'll be like the E-5 from Olympus. Their last DSLR that the people with good glass HAD to get and still want. E-5 never went down in price and gets a good price on the used market.
I'm a Pentax fan too, about £8,000 in spend since 2011 says so. But I'm past this emotional stuff about brands. Decisions based on emotion are not necessarily good decisions. Pentax needs to consider the competition and the competition really is the Sony A7 series. I used to consider Sony a non-brand regards cameras but these are the guys to watch over the next few years.

The concept of the A7 series is near perfect for me, but naturally the first iteration in the series wasn't that great, especially regarding the A7r which has many issues (mostly down to AF and that SHAAAA-DONK! shutter and shutter lag, battery life).

By the 3rd generation the A7 series will be quite incredible looking at the advances already made in the A7II. The Sony Zeiss lens partnership works pretty well with a good roadmap being communicated to the market. Zeiss Loxia are also quite gorgeous.

Notice the word 'communicated' in the last paragraph. Pentax has almost no effective market communication and I think this is why it's a niche brand dependent on the committed few. This is evident from the Pentax interview in the topic above this one.

So, for me, I'm going to wait. Wait to see what Pentax does. Wait to see what Sony does. Also wait and see if any good PK>E-mount AF adapters come available (this will decide whether I keep the FA Limited's).

In the meantime I'm going to sell off all the stuff I don't use and can't cart around the place, lighten the load, get it down to a usable, mobile and therefore enjoyable kit.
I hear you. There are collectors and there are photographers. After a while, collecting is just pointless. You have to use the equipment. Way more enjoyable. It's like Rowan Atkinson driving his priceless McClaran constantly versus the guy who kept it in the garage. When you read the forums, you can see some people collect FA lenses like the 200mm macro. Pointless! Sell off your unused gear.

It's not emotional for me. I want the FF camera to avoid the hassle of switching and selling everything. I'll buy it for that reason alone. (In case Pentax is reading, it needs to be under 2000...)
I use all my FF equipment on film still with the full frame size. Film does get expensive, but the results are often better than some of the digital stuff I've seen with other brands.
It's the same reason I want a really good AF adapter for PK>E-mount. I want to be able to use those FA's and not just in MF.

Honestly, the last time I hauled a load of heavy gear through an international airport . . . was the last time I'll ever haul a load of heavy gear through and international airport.

The aim is to get everything (except off-camera flash gear, reflectors and wotnot, tripods and the like) into either the Domke F7 or better still the Domke F6 . . . hand luggage only. Then I have a dinky Domke F-9 for when I just take the A7r and one lens, small fill flash and a few bits and pieces (like a Manfrotto 709B mini tripod, I highly recommend this!)

Looking at the size and weight of the new FF Pentax zooms. Looking at the likely size and likely weight of that FF camera. Throw on a grip too. It's just not for me, not anymore, takes all the joy out of it.
I really understand you! The partnership Sony <> Zeiss is of big importance. It's a very good branding too. People like the brand Zeiss and the names of the several lens constructions. Besides it is "top" quality. I mentioned "emotion" and that is true, "emotion" is a very important part of the buying-arguments of customers. And this is the point now. Which brand is going to win (or already won) the credits of the general public .....???? This is not only related to quality (people on the street really don 't know .....). They listen to and hear the "shouting" of the big brands (Canon, Nikon I am ..... SONY, make believe etc.) So this is marketing, be good and tell/SHOUT it. This is the problem of Pentax. The quality is (too) good (for example K5IIS, nice 16MP sensor, no noise, no AA-filter, robust metal body, VERY sharp, second place after D800....) however no one knows (I mean the big public). At the end only brands with big/huge market shares will survive. That's the reason of surviving of the brand Harley-Davidson alongside other comparable brands in the early times. However, marketing is expensieve .... We will wait and shoot (not collect) and see what future will bring....
I own a K-5IIs and a K-3 and an A7r.

I'm giving the K-5IIs+grip along with the FA 50/1.4 to a friend who just got divorced to cheer him up. I had some great work out of that camera, I mean some of my best came from that camera. It's a superb camera.

The K-3 is just to heavy for me. It's a beautifully engineered piece of equipment but too heavy and an extra burden. I'll miss it in some ways, but it's a little noisy when the ISO is mildly pushed, I think the K-5IIs is actually a better camera, but that's just my opinion.

The A7r, for all it's quirks, is on the right path. Sony are making something I don't mind carrying.

Today I went on a coastal landscape shoot. Took FA Ltd. 31/43/77, FE55/1.8, Samyang 14/2.8 and Tair-11A of all things. The best pics came from the FE55 and the Sammy (that is a great lens! but make sure you get a good one). The 31 was hopeless because of that stupid fixed hood, couldn't stack the ND filters. The 43 I didn't use. The 77, sadly I missed focus on some good shots. MF is hit and miss with me these days.

Looking at Sony 16-35/4, might be a really good option. Need to sell a bunch of stuff first to try and balance the books.

Thinking about the hike today (my knees are not as confident as they once were), there's absolutely no chance I could haul heavy gear again, I actually couldn't do it.. It has to be small(ish) and as light as possible whilst providing top notch output. That Pentax FF with the big glass is off the list now. Wish I could, but I know in reality it will just sit in the dry cabinet because I literally can't.

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