A recent discussion at my last Blog entry inspires me to write something more about the topic..
http://ricehigh.blogspot.com/2010/10/a5012-vs-da5514-what-would-you-choose.html#IDComment102987067
As you can see, a 55mm/1.4 lens on APS-C will give the user a 84.4mm equivalent AoV (Angle of View) to Full Frame but only at f/2.15 DoF wise, even when it is wide opened at f/1.4. So, in comparison, if you have one of those excellent previous Pentax 85/1.4 film lenses which is closed down to f/2.2, without any doubt, the optical quality of the image must be higher than that of the 55mm lens that must be wide opened in order to get the *same* shallower DoF. And, if the user just wants even shallower DoF with an APS-C system, he is just helpless!
Furthermore, to use lenses that have a mis-matched image circle is just a waste of the lens and its designed resolution. Unfortunately, this is just the case for many Pentax "DA" lenses that actually have a FF image circle, e.g., the DA*55, DA 40 and 70 Limited etc. With cropped centre of the lens, there is always a "strong" argument that the "sweet spot" of the lens is used. That is true to a certain extent but those people do have forgot another even more important and real point, i.e., the effective resolution of the cropped centre of the lens is decreased considerably!
Just say even the best Leica lens can have a centre resolution of 80 lp/mm at a MTF of 50%, that lens is NOT going to beat a cheap P&S DC which has a really small sensor at 1/2.3" etc. in terms of lp/mm figures! So, you can see how a mis-match image circle will have a real adverse impact on the optical performance and final effective resolution that can be delivered by a lens!
Grass is not always greener at the other sides neither, though. Whilst in Pentaxland there is always the big chaos of lenses with different image circles in the same lineup with the same nomenclature, i.e., the DA "family", quite some users of Canon and Nikon do also have committed the same mistake in matching their lenses with their cropped APS-C bodies. Yes, compatibility and future upgradability is ensured for buying FF lenses to use with their APS-C body but that is not going to help them to have better IQ and more effective resolution than to use lenses with matching image circle than to mis-match, i.e., to put real APS-C lenses on their APS-C bodies rather than to use FF lenses! Say for two real examples according to my real experience: my Canon cheapo EF 50/1.8II performs obviously better on my old 12M 5D resolution wise than it is put on a 550D with 18M of which the 50% higher resolution sensor just won't help. The other example is that when a EF-S 55-250 lens is put on the 550D, the results are not noticeably worse than when I put my EF 70-200L on the same 550D, despite that the L tele-zoom is just four to five times more expensive! It is JUST because it is a FF lens! (No matter how high grade it is..)
So, the above are just the two major points of why Full Frame! Those are actually have being overlooked by many DSLR users. Even now noise has been somehow improved for the late APS-C sensors with new manufacturing and image processing technologies. But the physics is still here and it is always in action - with the same technology, one can get either more resolution and/or lower noise with a Full Frame sensor!
Nevertheless, there are always two sides of anything. If you're shooting macro photos more often for which the shooter always desired more DoF (but not less) and that in particular if you're shooting insects or butterflies etc. which are really small and/or you couldn't come closer and always want longer reach, the APS-C cropped machines are for you! Ditto for bird shooting, which the longer reach is always desired!
So, someone would put case to extremes then. For example, they would say that the Medium Format is better than the FF and that the micro-4/3 does have tighter crop and longer reach than the APS-C. Well, the simple answer to both proposition is Yes but do think more about the other issues and compromises also! And, old wisdom told us that put things to extremes always do no good and generality is hurt! :-o
In fact, there are a lot of "calculations" on the web in comparing APS-C Vs FF, e.g., diffraction limit for maximum resolution, DoF and so on, which I think whilst most of them are correct for the maths, they are not much meaningful in practical sense. These are not going to help one to know about if FF or APS-C will suit him/her better - Only understanding the basic but major differences I've iterated above and then think/check with one's own need(s) should be more helpful and useful!
Read Also:-
If Size Really Matters, What's the Meaning of Micro-4/3 Now?
FA*85 on FF Vs 43 Limited on 2X (m4/3)
Compatibility of DA Lenses on Full Frame
Some Macro Photos to Share (DFA 100 on 5D)
Sample Photos of Full Frame Fisheye and 43 Limited on 5D
• News about Products and Latest Company Direction
• Summaries of Reported Problems and Potential Issues
• Technical Articles on Photographic Gear and Technologies
Sunday, October 10, 2010
Two Major Meanings of Full Frame - Choice of Shallower DoF and Most Optical Quality from (FF) Lenses
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Two Major Meanings of Full Frame - Choice of Shallower DoF and Most Optical Quality from (FF) Lenses
2010-10-10T01:01:00+08:00
RiceHigh
645D|Full Frame|ILDCs|Image Quality|Lenses|My Gear|Sensors|System Compatibility|Technical Articles|
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bandymelis · 753 weeks ago
I am really trying to be practical in my life in all areas, not just to "have" better. I want the results to be better, not the equipment. So, in my case, there is no need to go for FF (except, maybe, if the price drops to the same level as APS-C, I mean $1000 or less).
david · 753 weeks ago
I have an FA* 85mm 1.4, as well as a A 50mm 1.4. Both open wide on my K10d, the 50mm has a shallower depth of field. To my eye, the 85mm has the perfect range of DOF I have ever seen, and I now know why it was one of the greatest AF lenses Pentax has ever produced. I love the 50mm as well.
I have a perfectly working 16-50 DA* (and it was one of the early models), and the depth of field isn't as tight as either of the others, but it is a 2.8 after all
At work, we also have used a Sigma 70-200mm 2.8 which at one time was mounted to a Nikon D100, then a Nikon D300. The DOF on theat, in addition to the softness of the high end, was so shallow it was tough to work with. We replaced it with the Tamron, which is great.
Granted, this was all with APS-C cameras, and with most lenses designed to be used on full framers, but really the glass, not the sensor affects DOF. And really, its f-stop, as the only issues I see with APS-C designed lenses versus full framers are the opening is such that at wide angles, the APS-C lenses have some major vignetting.
As far as quality of image, of course, the larger sensor is better for photos, but how much do 90 percent of photographers need or want? I would merit the possibility that for a vast majority of people, if you put a P/S sensor in a SLR, they would be satisfied, as the only thing they are looking for is zoom capability. Others, the only reason they think they want an SLR is because of lower light situations. I want quality, but after the 10MP barrier, each jump in size of sensor and MP is really helping light sensitivity.
Here is a question for you - which would you rather have, the Nikon D1, in its full frame glory, or the Pentax K5? where do you feel full frame surpasses APS-C? Are all Canon 5Ds better than every APS-C camera, or is only the latest generation better than the current generation of smaller sensor cameras?
RiceHigh 110p · 753 weeks ago
As for the bokeh quality, it is just another thing, which is not related to the DoF anyway.
Fred · 752 weeks ago
I agree with your points.
FF gives more advantages than APS-C shooters give it credit for.
Moreover, it is a travesty that Pentax doesn't provide an FF body considering the existing 135 lens base.
However, in the short term (other than DOF), sensor improvements are compensating for much (as long as you are willing to buy "wider" glass).
In the mid-term (8 years+), everything is moot.
All our lenses will be paperweights. Processors will compensate for, and rule over, optics. Lenses will be super-fast and sharp primes. No other criteria will be important. I can see a light-efficient 200MP sensor with focus information at the pixel level. DOF can then be created with a slide bar.
It is all part of selling volume. Simplify. Simplify. Simplify. (but give great results).
Anonymous · 752 weeks ago